Perhaps Charles can give us more info?:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Seagull-Outboard- ... 240%3A1318
I won't be bidding, as lovely as they are, not really practical for me with the spares situation.
Little forty on the bay?
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Charles uk
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- Location: Maidenhead Berks UK
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timberman2004
- Posts: 375
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:11 pm
- Location: Lerryn Cornwall
Yes, Charles is right, I have a weakness for these little motors. They were the first that Bill Pinniger designed right from scratch, and they were immediately popular.
They represented a departure from the 102, which was all that British Seagull had produced up to beforehand, as they were the first of their designs that sported a separate aluminium cylinder head. Of course they were much smaller than the company's existing motors, too.
That cylinder head is fastened to the crankcase with long studs threaded at aither end. Separated by steel head and base gaskets, you have an alloy/steel/iron/steel/aluminiumk sandwich with fasteners passing through the water jacket. I have a couple of these where salt water use has done a remarkable job of corroding large lumps of aluminium away with the aid of the galvanic forces generated!
So as a practical working motor, the vendor states this one is OK, and I have no reason to doubt him. But if it isn't then spares are a problem. No spare crankcase/head/block/gasket spares have been available for decades; the only way you'll find these is by buying another FV/FVP. It's because of this that I can't recommend these as motors to use and to rely on.. If you're after a small Seagull then go for a Forty Minus/Featherweight. With those they had sorted out all the problems.
As a collector's motor these come into their own. They're dinky and cute, they're not rare but uncommon enough to attract interest, and they are almost completely different in detail from any other Seagulls. If you look at that one you'll see that the carburettor, fuel pip, magneto and filler cap are standard Seagull stuff. So is the exhaust.
The rest is different. The bracket is like a scaled down forty bracket, much more delicate. The water pump housing has no clench bolt; the drive shaft casing is threaded, and screws in directly.
This particular example has seen some service, and examination of the photos shows that the water pump housing is a clench bolt version (from a Forty Minus/Featherweight). The gearbox is a later replacement, too. So is the prop.
I can't be sure about the drive shaft casing tube, but it may be the original, clamped on the crankcase by another clenchbolt ring, and I can't be sure about the ring, either. The bracket looks like the proper one, but it's hard to tell without both types side by side. It's missing its security bar.
The tiller arm is a later model. The original would have been brass with a pressed steel end fitting which attaches to another pressed steel bracket. Some FV's had a small stub tiller stuck straigh onto the forward side of thre crankcase. This one has a later throttle lever, too.
So as a motor to use, I wouldn't.
AS a collector's motor then it's missing a few bits should you wish to pursue an entirely original motor:
Gearbox
Water pump housing
Security bar
Tiller arm
Throttle
Thrust block 'cotton reels' for the bracket
Propellor
Of course we can't see the carburettor.
The price for this one as it stands is rather steep.
Hope that helps
They represented a departure from the 102, which was all that British Seagull had produced up to beforehand, as they were the first of their designs that sported a separate aluminium cylinder head. Of course they were much smaller than the company's existing motors, too.
That cylinder head is fastened to the crankcase with long studs threaded at aither end. Separated by steel head and base gaskets, you have an alloy/steel/iron/steel/aluminiumk sandwich with fasteners passing through the water jacket. I have a couple of these where salt water use has done a remarkable job of corroding large lumps of aluminium away with the aid of the galvanic forces generated!
So as a practical working motor, the vendor states this one is OK, and I have no reason to doubt him. But if it isn't then spares are a problem. No spare crankcase/head/block/gasket spares have been available for decades; the only way you'll find these is by buying another FV/FVP. It's because of this that I can't recommend these as motors to use and to rely on.. If you're after a small Seagull then go for a Forty Minus/Featherweight. With those they had sorted out all the problems.
As a collector's motor these come into their own. They're dinky and cute, they're not rare but uncommon enough to attract interest, and they are almost completely different in detail from any other Seagulls. If you look at that one you'll see that the carburettor, fuel pip, magneto and filler cap are standard Seagull stuff. So is the exhaust.
The rest is different. The bracket is like a scaled down forty bracket, much more delicate. The water pump housing has no clench bolt; the drive shaft casing is threaded, and screws in directly.
This particular example has seen some service, and examination of the photos shows that the water pump housing is a clench bolt version (from a Forty Minus/Featherweight). The gearbox is a later replacement, too. So is the prop.
I can't be sure about the drive shaft casing tube, but it may be the original, clamped on the crankcase by another clenchbolt ring, and I can't be sure about the ring, either. The bracket looks like the proper one, but it's hard to tell without both types side by side. It's missing its security bar.
The tiller arm is a later model. The original would have been brass with a pressed steel end fitting which attaches to another pressed steel bracket. Some FV's had a small stub tiller stuck straigh onto the forward side of thre crankcase. This one has a later throttle lever, too.
So as a motor to use, I wouldn't.
AS a collector's motor then it's missing a few bits should you wish to pursue an entirely original motor:
Gearbox
Water pump housing
Security bar
Tiller arm
Throttle
Thrust block 'cotton reels' for the bracket
Propellor
Of course we can't see the carburettor.
The price for this one as it stands is rather steep.
Hope that helps