Model 170

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fleetingcontact
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Model 170

Postby fleetingcontact » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:17 pm

Someone I know recently acquired a model 170. It is complete, it works, is cosmetically ok (the usual rusty driveshaft tube). No I don't have a pic...

What might it be worth please?

pat777
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Re: Model 170

Postby pat777 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:45 pm

fleetingcontact wrote:What might it be worth please?


Not very helpful I know, but it's worth as much as someone is willing to pay for it!

I presume you know about the problems with the con rods on them.

http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/i_ ... series.htm

There never seems to be much discussion about prices on this forum and talking up prices on the rarer models is generally frowned upon. I guess anyone who knows about the problems with the con rod would be put off buying one so that may reduce the value of them somewhat, although if you read the article on the main SOS site, someone has come up with a "fix" for the problematic con rod.

Are you thinking of buying it?

pat777
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Re: Model 170

Postby pat777 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:48 pm

Seagull 170.jpg
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pat777
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Re: Model 170

Postby pat777 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:56 pm

Martyn Sandbrook's Model 160 inboard "fixed" con rod made from bronze, same power unit as model 170 and 125.

http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/i_ ... series.htm

model 160 con rod.jpg


model 160 con rod 2.jpg


model 160 con rod 3.jpg
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fleetingcontact
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Re: Model 170

Postby fleetingcontact » Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:22 pm

Yup, read all the stuff from Jon's website.

Nope, don't think I want it since I have a lot on the go anyhow. The owner is not an enthusiast but rather a leader of a Seascout troop who came by it in the recent purchase of a boat. Personally I think the item is unsuitable for his purposes especially as it does not have a kill switch (yes I know it can be made to have one) and this would be esential for insurance purposes. So if it was sold then the proceeds would go to what is possibly the best Seascout troop in the country. So wossit worth?

Also, just because its interesting, what would be involved in adding a kill switch? I guess the starting point would be a Mk4 ignition module with the extra wire..ere we go...

pat777
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Re: Model 170

Postby pat777 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:40 pm

Ah well sure seen as it's for a good cause you'll probably get away with looking for a valuation on here. Hopefully someone who knows more about them than me will advise you accordingly.

There is a 125 seagull on ebay at the minute starting off at bids of £199, mind you it's been up a few days now with no interest at that price. It has been cut down though during the restoration to be made into a short shaft, which could be putting people off I suppose.

I've never seen a 170 for sale on ebay,not that I'm on there looking the whole time, so maybe I've missed them. I'm sure they come up now and again but I guess a lot of them were scrapped with the problems.

I wouldn't be interested in buying it myself given the problems, certainly it could be an investment piece as in 50 years there probably won't be many of them still left in tact.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/British-Seagu ... SwaBhZitPF

seagull 125.jpg
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fleetingcontact
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Re: Model 170

Postby fleetingcontact » Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:53 pm

Hi again Pat.

It really is as I said... no lies. I have also offered to assist in making it all work if needed. If it could be fitted with a kill switch without acres of grief then it may serve as a stand-by motor.

Because I imagine few survived in a working condition, I guess it has a rarity value, albeit for the wrong reasons. How I wish it had turned out to be a 5R. It would have been like kicking a hornet's nest...

Saw the one on Ebay. The vendor has polished - not painted - the gearbox. Oh dear how sad never mind. Looks nice until those later-model casings kiss salt water...

If anyone has good info on the kill switch thing please begin a new thread. That way it will be findable via a search.

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Charles uk
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Re: Model 170

Postby Charles uk » Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:55 pm

I remanufactured 10 number 170 conrods with phosphor bronze end caps with a lighter end cap, as my calculations led me to believe there could be a problem with the crank balance at over 4000 revs with the heavier Martyn cap.

These were built for racing & providing they were installed properly ran up to 6000 revs with no problems, the only problem with them was the cost! £120.00 each.

My blue 175 that I've been racing for about 10 years is running a 5R crank & rod, with ball & needle bearings everywhere, I'm too embarrassed to say what that exercise cost.

It was fitted with a kill switch when it left Seagull! That black button below the 5 in the 125 is the kill switch, & it might require a recoil starter fix.

There should be a thin kill switch wire hanging from the CDI base plate, short to stop!
If it's missing it's a remove the flywheel job.
Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot.

fleetingcontact
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Re: Model 170

Postby fleetingcontact » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:02 pm

Charles. where would we be without you!

I would love to hear to story of the 5R con-rod conversion. Write a book!

Tell us more of the kill switch thing and how to do it. Start a new thread please.

pat777
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Re: Model 170

Postby pat777 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:23 pm

Charles uk wrote:It was fitted with a kill switch when it left Seagull! That black button below the 5 in the 125 is the kill switch, & it might require a recoil starter fix.

There should be a thin kill switch wire hanging from the CDI base plate, short to stop!
If it's missing it's a remove the flywheel job.


I think Charles is saying that your Sea scout model 170 should already have a kill switch, as it left the factory with one fitted. See the small black button on the image of the 170.

fleetingcontact
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Re: Model 170

Postby fleetingcontact » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:27 pm

Yup, the penny dropped a moment ago. I'm a glass of wine or two in here. Thanks Pat (and Charles), I will advise the chap accordingly. :shock:

pat777
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Re: Model 170

Postby pat777 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:30 pm

That's allowed! Seen as I went to the trouble of snipping this out and saving it, I may as well continue with posting it for those who have not spotted it in the main photo. Hopefully they will decide to keep it, good to get some more young people interested in Seagulls.

Seagull 170 snipping.JPG
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fleetingcontact
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Re: Model 170

Postby fleetingcontact » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:10 pm

I'm fairly sure the majority of actual scouts woudn't give a monkey's wossname about Seagulls. Those cats just wanna have fun. :P

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Oyster 49
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Re: Model 170

Postby Oyster 49 » Wed Aug 23, 2017 11:44 am

I developed my love of British Seagulls in the 1970s in the sea scouts. Last time I was there I even managed to scrounge a petrol tank from one of the very same engines, that was found at the back of a cupboard 8)

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Oyster 49
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Re: Model 170

Postby Oyster 49 » Wed Aug 23, 2017 11:47 am

I think the big ends on the 125 and 170 are ok in normal operation as long as the oil mix is maintained and the engine is not over revved generally, and in particular when in neutral. Just plenty of care required I imagine.


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