TC-W3 Oil

[Gannet]

Is cheap TC-W3 2 stroke oil just as suitable for our old engines as the more readily available over the counter and far more expensive stuff?

I have seen some which state:- 'special blend of highly refined mineral oils balanced proportionately with synthetic based ashless additives'.
It sounds alright to me. The price is good. There cannot be any problems with it - can there?

Jeremy

[Charles uk]

They were designed to run on SAE 30 grade engine oil.

Many Kiwis race with this as they belive they get better performance.

[fortyplus]

My personal opinion is that with the volume of oil being run through the motor with 10:1 or 25:1 ratios, as long as the oil is a reputable brand of TC-3 there's nothing to worry about from a mechanical standpoint. However for environmental reasons, if this concerns you, there is a case for running some of the synthetics, but also possibly a downside. I ran Amsoil full synthetic through my 90 for probably 12 hours or so on one particular trip. There was almost no smoke or odour and it ran like a champ. The oil from the exhaust almost immediately emulsified and would even come out in creamy lumps when stopped which if touched broke up immediately in the water, which I felt good about as I was boating in pristine clear fresh water. My only concern with this would be subsequent storage of the motor if I lived in a wetter climate, living in a desert state means things like corrosion are now just distant memories of the days of living in blighty. I would however be concerned about internal motor corrosion if the motor was to be stored, moist air in the crankcase etc. might just breakdown the oil enough to cause a problem.

Since then I have used a Penzoil semi synthetic which seems to reduce smoke and odour as well but looks more like a real oil when exiting the exhaust, dark brown and oily. it is also quite a bit cheaper and more readily available, my main reason for the change in my circumstances.

[Gannet]

Thanks for your comments.
You have said 'as long as the oil is a reputable brand of TC-3 there is nothing to worry about from a mechanical standpoint'.
That exactly is the nub of the problem.

Is the product from a small company with no real brand reputation, just as good (for our purposes), as one from a large multi-national global company with a well known brand name.
My gut feeling is that it probably is; but I really don't know. I suspect the well known brand names have jacked the prices up way beyond what in many cases is reasonable. Do we end up buying the branded product so as to feel 'safe'(?).
Jeremy

[fortyplus]

Well they all have to submit to testing to get the classification for their oil,so they all should be OK. Interestingly Amsoil outboard oil has not completed the test despite being highly rated by everyone using it. I don't know which manufacturers oils are available in the UK, here it's pretty easy if you live near Walmart to just pick up the oil they have which are name brands at good prices. For the amount you actually use in a Seagull given their good fuel economy, it's not worth scrimping a few pounds and having the worry of whether unknown Brand X is OK or not. If there are supply issues in your area then buying off the internet is an easy option. Here in UT with all the lakes and reservoirs there are numerous sporting and hunting goods stores that also sell 2 stroke outboard oil, so I'm spoiled for choice. My opinion is that I'd run a TC=W3 over just the engine oil they originally used because I think a modern oil will provide possibly better lubrication and it burns off cleaner. I use the Penzoil Semi synth oil, because it's readily available and also because I don't see any harm in trying to give the old girls the best lubricating properties within reason. At the end of the day you pay your money and take your choice, I doubt any of us use our Seagulls enough and in circumstances where we can definitively say Brand X gives the best performance and least wear, but in my opinion it's worth using a good modern oil to preserve what you have.

Price wise it's about $5 for a quart of Penzoil semi synthetic, or Walmart has their own brand TC-3w at about $12 a gallon. I've used both, but have now gone to the semi synthetic for the cleaner burn and the hope it might lube a little better. With the prices in the USA and the amount of usage mine get, the cost of either product is pretty irrelevant if you can go a whole season on one quart. Even at 10:1 one quart would give you 20 US gallons of fuel, it takes a good day on the water to even burn a gallon in my experience - so at 25:1 and 50 US gallons it's likely several seasons worth - so why take a chance and why not feed it something approaching the best? I'm sure the cleaner burning modern oils help keep the deposits down inside the motors too.

[headdownarseup]

i've been using ROCK tcw-3 for a while now (semi-synthetic) and it seems pretty good stuff to me.
the "old dears" dont seem too worried.
seems to emulsify quite quickly and break down in water which is good from an environmental point.

jon

[fortyplus]

i've been using ROCK tcw-3 for a while now (semi-synthetic) and it seems pretty good stuff to me.
the "old dears" dont seem too worried.
seems to emulsify quite quickly and break down in water which is good from an environmental point.

jon

That's pretty much my thoughts on using the semi synth, no point advertising that 25:1 ratio with plumes of smoke, while I'm no tree hugging environmentalist, I don't believe in polluting water any more than is necessary, seeing the part, and full synthetic, break down so quickly in the water, as opposed to leaving an oil slick, does make you feel better.,

I did find the Amsoils ability to mix with water in the exhaust tube a bit of a nightmare on shore, that thing could ooze coffee coloured clotted cream endlessly after a good run and I definitely had to resort to putting a plastic bag over the leg for transport. The semi synth seems to break down to some extent, but doesn't instantly mix with the water in the exhaust itself.

[Collector Inspector]

https://www.nmma.org/certification/cert ... tc-w3.aspx

B

[haventaclue]

My tuppence worth.If the bottle states that the contents meet xyz standard and that meets the requirement of your outboard/car/pickup/tank,then it will do the job.It must,otherwise litigation to beat the band.
There are only so many,few,refineries and a lot of brands and the oil in Brand X @ £20 will be,more than likely,be the same oil as in Brand Y @ £10.

[headdownarseup]

exactly!
go with what you know.
if in doubt ask someone in the marine industry,
they're bound to know, after all, they work on these types of engines every day and have probably seen the aftermath of poor lubrication and what it eventually does to a 2 stroke engine!
although these days, there seems to be more of a shift towards 4 stroke motors now that the second hand market is starting to become flooded with used examples that can be picked up for quite a good price compared to when new!
jon

[fortyplus]

Despite the common sense and reasoning behind any TC-3w oil being fine, it's still tempting to go with one of the more exotic flavors just because the lube might be better and the actual reduced smell and smoke, in my experience . With one quart/liter of oil giving you 50-60 hours of use, in the worst case you wasted a couple of bucks/quid, if it doesn't reduce wear at all. I tend to like to stay with the same oil once I get going with a particular brand, so my criteria is probably a premium oil which is readily available. The Penzoil Semi Synth falls in that category because it is available just about everywhere, just about all Walmarts have it, but I've seen it in the "Mum & Pop" Marina stores etc. (admittedly at a much higher price) if I'm ever stuck.

As I like to use ethanol free gas only and can only seem to buy it locally, my problem is I always end up with a big can of 2 stroke gas, ready to go stale at the season's end, as I always seem to mix too much at some point before going on a trip or during it, despite taking cans containing just ethanol free gas that I keep in reserve trying to mix as needed. I recently acquired a very nice low hours late seventies 175 hp V6 Mercury 2 stroke motor, I bet at full throttle that could burn all my surplus 2 stroke up in under an hour, even if I had to double it's quantity by diluting it further to 50:1 If I finish getting it mounted on my Mirage boat and in the water before winter it should take care of the 6 gallons of 2 stroke that's currently threatening to not get used otherwise before winter. I've promised my self only to run it on the portable tanks this year to avoid being out of the frying pan and into the fire if I start filling the main tank on that boat.

An interesting (or not) side note on TC-W3 2 stroke oil, here in the States many add it to their diesel fuel 1 oz per US gallon to help keep the old style injector pumps lubed and the injectors since the switch to low sulphur diesel has reduced the lubrication of the fuel. In independent tests it actually increases fuel mileage too, by 1-2 mpg working better than most of the specific diesel additives on the market. Apparently the oil has more fuel energy than the diesel fuel!! The TC-W3 is used because it burns completely in the hot cylinders of a diesel engine, you see no smoke or otherwise to suggest it's use. I use it in my John Deere backhoe and pick up truck, the Walmart own brand Supertech at about $12 a gallon and is the one used in the tests published.

[OverseasSoul]

I've been thinking about oils as well and have ordered some Redline fully synthetic, biodegradable watercraft 2-stroke oil on Amazon that should arrive for next weekend's activities. Will let you know the result - going to run my CPCL at 1:16 with it.

[Gannet]

Thanks for all your comments.
Pricewise a litre of 'premium' 2 stroke oil in the UK is in the order of £10 ie $16. That is for a litre not a gallon!
Jeremy

[Adrian Dale]

I use TC-W3 mixed at 8 or 10 to 1 depending on the engine. The brand used is Evintrude simply because my charter boat was powered by Evintrude so have a few 25 litre drums available. In the early days I used SAE 30.. much better aroma

Either way never had a problem with lack of lubrication

aj

[Stelios_Rjk]

I use the cheapest that complies with the TC-W3. 5.5euros per litre. They are Seagulls after all, not a sophisticated or a performance engine.