Saving Old Seagulls

Hi guys,

new to the forum but have owned a number of Seagulls in the past and never, ever had a problem with the old beauties.

Couple of weeks ago I bought a 1982 (one of the first) 170. From the look of her she's never been in salt water. Been stored for 15 years according to the seller but fired up in the tank third or fourth pull. Replaced the plug (NGK rather than original Champion). Put her on my 18ft sailing cruiser and yesterday motored from Orford to Aldeburgh and back and she never missed a beat. About 2 and a half hours with and against the tide.

Now here's the problem. My mate rang me from the boat today to say that she had started no problem. He had left her running at idle speed while he sorted out one or two bits on board. After about 5 minutes the engine stopped and wouldn't restart until he had taken the plug out and cleaned it. He described the sound of the engine at this time as "going up and down" which, in a car, I would call "hunting". Did the plug oil up after idling for that long? Is it possible to use a "hotter" plug to get over this? Thoughts on this would be very welcome.

Having now obtained a complete set of the manuals and parts lists I see that an optional extra for this engine is an alternator. Is this the same alternator as fitted to the QB? Does anyone know where I might obtain an alternator for my engine?

The current Seagull owners tell me that only 50 or so of these engines remain in service. I feel quite proud to own one of them and it would be very good if I could upgrade her to have an alternator, at which point I believe she would rival any modern engine in fulfilling my requirements.

I have enjoyed reading quite a lot of posts in the forum and you are obviously a very helpful and knowledgeable bunch. I hope you feel able to help with my little problems.

Best regards,

John

I used to motor from Snape bridge down the Ald to the sea with a 170, on an old ships jolly boat, still have and now go Waldringfield to Felixstowe. Try a hotter plug, mine used to oil up too.
P

If you observe carefully, you will see no cooling water coming out of the tell tale at tickover.
5 minutes with no cooling water flow, will probably cause the motor to stop by overheating the piston & causing a small seizure, not the best idea in a Seagull nearly 30 years old.

One of the problems with an outboard that has a completely enclosed powerhead is that you can't feel or see how hot everything is getting!

Clutched or FNR Seagulls that are idling need to be left running at a speed that ensures a good water flow!

If your in any way mechanical I would probably recommend giving your 170 a complete once over just to check all is well in the piston, ring areas, as I would doubt that there are many new pistons left at Seagull or John's.
170's ran the largest carb main jet, Amal 140, just to keep the temperature of the piston within reasonable limits, in this high powered powerhead (well high powered for 102 ccs).

I'm sure John can find you an alternator in his huge stock pile.

Thanks Charles, I suspected something like that had happened. Fortunately the old girl fired up again a little later but stopped again when put into gear. I think I can put this situation down to operator error, my pal doesn't really understand matters mechanical.

Do you happen to know if the alternator is common to all this type of engine?

John

Assuming the 170 has the standard CDI, then this would be the one. I understand they rust easily and not many survived. Sorry about size. Yet to work out how to reduce!

Cheers Hugo.

Thanks Hugo,

Is this for sale and if so how much? If not, what would I look to be paying for one?

regards, John

The flywheel cover for a 170 is quite different from this one as the inlet manifold won't allow this model to fit.

The 170 cover is vented for CDI cooling.

Hi Hugo,

Have PM'd you.

John

I like this idea for running lights at least
could this actually charge a battery[voltage}?
but i think your flywheel is not exposed so would be no good for you...
but what a cool idea for a seagull!

http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/ne ... 20lite.jpg

Hi Niander,

According to John most 170s came with an alternator as standard and the owner's manual lists them as optional extras. My layout is nothing like your picture.

The unit charges at a rate of 4 amp/h which is ample for charging a battery.

John

I could be wrong but I think you will find that if you fit one of these alternators you may also need to fit some kind of charge controller. The only control I think these units have is MANUAL and done by turning the connectors around, you can see it on the operating instructions photo previously. I think if you left it on full charge and just connected it to the battery direct it could well boil it dry!( or worse ) if you ran it for any length of time with no electric load on the battery. Perhaps someone who has one fitted or knows more about them can confirm or deny this?

Hi guys,

just got back from a couple of days on board. Waggles, you're right about the manual amp control but I spoke to John at SOS earlier in the week and he reckons that, with the amount of time the engine will be running (auxilliary on a small sailing cruiser) that it's best to just leave it on 4 amp all the time.

Does anyone know just how critical the depth of water the engine sits in is? My engine is a long shaft but the ob bracket on the boat is for a short shaft. I've used a piece of wood to chock the bracket about halfway down but I suspect the engine is still sitting too deep.

I've had problems starting and I can't get the engine to rev when under load, the best I can get is about a few revs over idling speed when in gear. If I open the throttle over half way the engine stops.

Could the depth of 2-3 inches over recommended be responsible for this or should I be looking elsewhere?

Thanks for those comforting words Bruce, would you care to expand?